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Selema: I'm underwater getting washed around in the white water. And then I come up and I scream as loud as I've ever screamed before, it was a visceral yell of spiritual awakening.

Paddy: And the direction of my life was chosen in that very moment.

In Song of myself, Walt Whitman describes it as the barbaric yawp, which is just this guttural expression of emotion. You bark and scream and yell, it's a prayer. It's a thank you. It's an expression of joy

Selema: it really is. Thank you, Mr. Whitman,

SHOW MUSIC

INTRO PADDY VO:

In our outdoor community, we talk a lot about culture; our values, our goofy language, our sometimes funny - often times inspiring behaviours and feats, the dirt-footed rituals and practices that shape our lives. Sometimes, those things are easy to define, like how a steep sweaty hike seems like a good first date option, or [00:01:00] how more conversations between strangers happen on chairlifts than any other transportation device in the history of everything, or how outdoorsy stickers on cars, roof boxes, water bottles, and coolers are a modern day Rosetta Stone that allows us to understand each other. Culturally speaking, those types of practicies are ingrained in our DNA.

But more often than not, culture is impossible to pin down into specific activities or descriptors or phrases. Culture is felt. And in order to make sense of feelings, you need a wordsmith, a storyteller, a poet even. You need...Selema Masekela.

PAUSE PAUSE

Since the early 90s, Selema has lived in the gooey emotional center of outdoor and action sports culture. He parlayed a deep personal love affair with skate, surf, and snowboarding into a gig at Transworld Skateboarding Magazine, and then he moved into his storied career in sports broadcasting, hosting the X Games and [00:02:00] Winter X Games, the Olympics...if you've watched the very best boardsports athletes on TV in the last 20-plus years, you've seen Selema.

And it takes someone who has been dedicated to the culture of the outdoors for decades to explicate its impact on an individual life and, more importantly, the impact on the folks who join in after you.

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Paddy: We start with burnt toast what's your last humbling and or hilarious moment outside?

Selema: I was at a red light on a bike ride last week a car, pulled in front of me to make a right hand turn. I was unable. To clip out and I took it to the cheeks and the shoulders. Full slam, in the middle of Abbott, Kenny, and Venice Boulevard, which is was, which is basically the town square.

No one helped me

Paddy: Oh God, dude.

, you're [00:03:00] just like, turtle on its back. Like, I can't get out. Oh God

Selema: Yeah, the whole, the whole thing was just wildly embarrassing. I finally get up,

and I just dusted myself off, adjusted my oakley's, and made sure that , there was no rippage to the Lycra that was going to expose parts of me that the world didn't

Paddy: Right, because the last thing you

Selema: got on my

Paddy: you, like, are fully embarrassed from falling over when you're clipped into your very expensive bike is to go full hams out.

Selema: Right or accidentally be starfishing universe.

Paddy: dude, ooohh, that now that is the image I want to start this interview with.

Selema: Next time you're like deeply embarrassed outside, just be like, eh, this is nothing in

Paddy: Selema almost went full balloon knot to public.

Selema: Hahaha

Paddy: So I'm okay.

Selema: Yes. I should have put that one on Strava

Paddy: yeah, the Balloon Knot Boulevard. Please let that be a section

All [00:04:00] right. Let's get into it,

MUSIC IN THE CLEAR

Take me back to 1988. You are a young kid who has just been transplanted across the country from New York to California, and you are seeing surfing and experiencing it for the first time. What did it feel like the first time you caught a wave? Where were you? How old were you? Put me in that moment.

Selema: I'll just put one asterisk on your fine research. I Had seen surfing in real life the year before.

I was in Australia with my father. My father was a, trumpet player, by the name of Hugh Masella. He was a ugal horn player.

Paddy: player.

Selema: Very, very, very famous trumpet player and singer.

And he was on tour with a guy named Paul Simon on the Graceland tour.

And my dad thought it would be wise education for me if he took me outta school. And I was a roadie on this [00:05:00] Paul Simon Graceland tour

Paddy: Are you kidding me,

Selema: in Australia

Paddy: dude?

Selema: to start things off. So if you've seen the movie Almost Famous,

Paddy: That was you.

Selema: me. That that's, that's me.

Paddy: My first jab was at the gap. Uh, you win.

Selema: I had other jobs before that my stepfather. used to clean office buildings and I would have to go with him at night to like clean supermarket floors until four in the morning. So I had, I had a balanced and then go to school the next day

Paddy: like janitorial services roadie for Paul Simon on one of the greatest albums of all time

Selema: Of all time, you know, balance, I was on both ends of the pendulum and everything in between. There was a, crew member on our local team in Sydney. Who every day he would come in to work in the mornings. And he would bring this spacecraft with him. That he would leave backstage

it looked like a, a spacecraft. I'd never seen a surfboard before. So I went up to him and I said, Hey, what is that? He [00:06:00] told me what it was. He's surfing. I'd seen, you know, I knew what surfing was and I was like, Ooh, I want to see that. I wanna do that. Be like, yeah, man, I, I'll, I'll, I'll try to take you some and whatever.

And finally one day he says to me, uh, man, I'm not gonna have time, but I'll tell you where you can go to see it. And I was like, sweet. And he gave me directions via ferry to go to Bondi Beach. Like literally where to go and sit to watch surfing. So I went, I took the ferry. I'm 15, , I buy a sandwich at this little sandwich shop and I sit on this bench and I'm waiting, I'm looking at the ocean.

And these two kids who are around my age, walk by, and they've got, the spaceships in their hands and they paddle out. And they start to catch waves. And I remember just sitting there just being like, this is break dancing on water.

Paddy: That's a cool way to describe it.

Selema: The thing that I picked up instantly was like , they're dancing, but they, they both had their different flair and while they were [00:07:00] friends, it was clear that they were battling each other in a healthy way.

Paddy: Battling each other, like on the same wave, or to get the wave

Selema: They were battling each other in the performance. Like, think about a bboy

Paddy: Yeah, yeah, sure,

Selema: Or like, if you're one person jumps in, da da dah, they do their dance moves, et cetera, and then there, and they pass it to you and it's like, oh shit. All right, well, I gotta do my

Paddy: gotta throw down

Selema: the same song. That's what it.

Looked like to me was taking place on the water at 15. And my brain was just like, what is, like mind blown? And, you know, did the rest of the tour, et cetera. And I didn't think about it again. But I did think in that day I was like, I don't know when I'll ever get a chance to do this thing, but if I ever got a chance to do it, I wanna try that.

A year later, I come home from school and my stepfather says, sits me down in mid-April and says, we're moving to California to a place called Carls Carlsbad. Your mother [00:08:00] doesn't want to be cold anymore. It was like, what, what, what are you, what are you talking about? I had a, you know, I had my little girlfriend, Dawn handy.

She, she ran cross country. I was in love with her. My life was, uh, was. The importance of all the things that you can think of with your friends in social circles in, in high school. Like what do you mean

Paddy: It's pinned.

Selema: ruining my life?

Paddy: at 11. Everything is super intense at 16, 17 years old

Selema: Yeah. And there's nothing important that adults can tell you is going to matter when you're 15. Like, what do you, you feed me, cloth me. Shut

Paddy: Get outta my way. I've got stuff

Selema: Get outta my way.

Paddy: and emotions.

Selema: Yeah. I'm living a life that you don't even know about. And

Paddy: me.

Selema: And we drove cross country in a U-Haul, got there in the dark, woke up in this strange place. And I remember walking out of [00:09:00] the win and in the morning to go and unload the, uh, the U-Haul with my stepdad, who I was just so cross with.

And, um, you smell this air, it's new. This is new air you're smelling. It's like, you're like, what is this air? This is may now, you know, and palm trees are swaying. The sky was a blue that I'd never really seen before. If you're watching the movie, the camera slowly pans right as this hazy sunrise.

And there about a mile and a half away is the sparkling Pacific Ocean. And I'm just like. Whoa. , where are we? And then this kid drives by on a purple Honda Revo scooter in board shorts, sandals. He's got blonde hair with a little waterfall in the back, Oakley blades. And he drives by, he's got his books in between his legs,

and, and he like beep beep like hits, hits the horn and throws me this weird hand sign that turns out to [00:10:00] be later known as the Chaka. And off he goes. And I'm like, that dude, can't he? That guy can't be going to school. There's no way. Like he's in a tank top and where I'm from, like, you would be sent home immediately suspended for Yeah.

You know,

Paddy: No exposed armpits.

Selema: like, what, what's going on here? And , I go to school, I'm dressed weird. I'm the one of the only kids who looks like me in the whole school of like a couple of thousand. And I meet these kids that. Invite me to go to lunch with them. We go get food and then go to the beach, to this parking lot to like hang out and eat lunch. And we're all sitting in the car and they're looking out at the ocean. And I see people bobbing out there and a guy paddles and stands up. And they start commentating the wave. Like they're just talking about like what they're seeing.

And I'm like, I'm in the back of the car. And I'm like, I've seen that before. I know that, I know that I was, I was, I was

Paddy: guys ever [00:11:00] heard of diamonds on the soles of her shoes? Let me tell you a story.

Selema: They're like, no, you like, what? What? Like, they called me. They used, they would, they were, my nickname instantly was East coast, like, no, east Coast. You don't know that. Whatever. I'm like, no. I was, I was in Australia last year at Bondi Beach and now their heads are

Paddy: sure. I bet. Yeah.

Selema: Like, what are you talking about?

I was like, I want to do that.

And, uh, that Saturday I sh I showed up at this dude's house. They had wetsuit and a board for me. And said they'll teach me, put on the wetsuit backwards. Everyone laughed at me, took it off, put it on the right way, and we went, they gave me the beach drill of how to pop up, et cetera.

And they told me that I wasn't gonna make it out to the lineup. But you know, just to practice in the white water. I was not interested in the whitewater. I was interested in being out where they were. And I, I fought and nearly drowned. I don't know how many times the waves were probably like three or four feet. But I made it out, and I'm sitting out there like wobbling, like can't even sit on the board [00:12:00] and they're like, what are, what are you doing out here? I'm like, and then a set comes. I'd never seen a set before. Now a set of like big waves are coming, or at least felt big to me. They were like head high.

I'm like, what do I do? Turn around and paddle. Paddle as hard as you can. And so legs splayed out wide behind me. I put my head down and I paddle as hard as I can and I felt this like beautiful unweighting. Of my spirit I'd never felt that before where you start to get lifted up by this, by the wave.

And it's like an unweight, like when you're on a trampoline on the way up, that first part where you hit the bottom and you're on the way up and you feel your stomach do that cool little thing before you decide if you're gonna try to do a flip or

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: , and you're like, oh my God, this feels amazing.

And then whoosh, it just, now you're, now you've been shot out of a cannon and it's , hurdling you down the face of the wave. And [00:13:00] I'm on the board bouncing around on my stomach, like freaking out at this new feeling I've never had before. I'd never touched a bodyboard or anything before that. Then I remembered the beach lesson and somehow or another I did the thing.

I just like popped up.

Paddy: seriously pop up on your first wave

Selema: I popped up on my first wave. I wish I was lying to you, but I'm not. I popped up and I stood there for about, we will call it, four seconds in the whitewater.

Paddy: Probably felt like 10 minutes though.

Selema: Felt like 10 minutes and I fall. I'm underwater getting washed around in the white water. And then I come up and I'm standing there and I just look around and I look up and I scream as loud as I've ever screamed before, like it was a visceral yell of spiritual awakening.

And to this day, I liken it to like time stopped. The universe paused. [00:14:00] Something was poured into me and the direction of my life was chosen in that very moment. I don't know what just happened, but this is where I am going for the rest of my life. And

Paddy: Such a good feeling

Selema: it was It was the most incredible feeling.

Also, I didn't stand up again for two months,

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

Paddy: I totally understand the emotional reaction , of screaming, in Song of myself, Walt Whitman describes it as the barbaric yawp, Y-A-W-P, which is just this guttural expression of emotion.

Because words can't capture what is going on in your soul, in your heart. And so all you do is you just, you bark and scream and yell, it's a prayer. It's a thank you. It's an expression of joy

Selema: it really is. Thank you, Mr. Whitman, really the barbaric yop, and I I love that you said that it's a prayer because up until that time in my life, my parents were [00:15:00] dragging me to church three days a week. I was in a very, very religious, conservative household and, doing your best to buy into the thing that everyone else has. They're feeling. But I have never felt that.

Paddy: No, totally. And my. relationship or experience with the church As a kid, I grew up, just outside of Chicago, Catholic, Irish, Catholic kid. I was always like, I'm just like here because I got drug here and I'm smuggling in like Lego guys to like play with.

There's a, I just was like, I don't feel the connection here where I have felt The connection though is in those moments outside,

Selema: Yeah. I've been churchgoing in some way, shape, or form now, for 36, 37 years. Like, That day. The

Paddy: The Church of the Whitewater.

Selema: the White Water, the Church of the Whitewater, the Church of the Mountains. The Church of the Outdoors, and the pursuit of expansive play.

Paddy: Well, what was your relationship with the outdoors prior to [00:16:00] that? What was your family's relationship? To the outdoors?

Selema: I was lucky that my mother and stepfather, who I spent most of my time with as a kid, they wanted my brother and I to have experiences and not just be city kids. So we would go to Cape Cod, Massachusetts, , and rent a small little cottage for a couple of weeks.

We went to the beach and I knew how to swim. My stepfather really made sure that I, that I was a good swimmer. And we had a pool at my local buildings that I lived in that no one else in our neighborhood had, which was key. I was outside a lot going and playing in the woods and hunting for snakes and things like that.

And I also grew up in the generation of kids that was like, what are you doing in the house?

Paddy: yeah, yeah. Go outside. I don't wanna see you till it's dark again. Yeah,

Selema: Yeah.

Paddy: When the street lights come on. Come inside.

Selema: That's how I grew up. I was just taught to be curious that way, we would go upstate, in the [00:17:00] summertime to this place called Bear Mountain and go on hikes and ex explore the outdoors. So I always felt drawn and curious about being outside.

And my father was a traveler. when I went on the road with him, we were always going, and exploring places and being curious about the outdoors, it wasn't a lifestyle, it was a destination.

Paddy: Mm.

Selema: You know, it was a destination, it was family vacation. I didn't know about the, the, the lifestyle part.

It was the equivalent of going to, an amusement park for free as a family. Is, is how I would look at, look at it.

Paddy: And so that moment in the water in Carlsbad is the entry point to arguably the rest of your life, right? Because it introduces you to surf, it introduces you then to skate, which then introduces you to snowboarding. Now. These sports have a lot in common, but they take place in totally different environments.

You know, you've got the cityscape, you've got [00:18:00] ocean, you've got the mountains. Do you find yourself drawing different things from those different environments as you move through them?

Selema: Absolutely. The thing that drew me to skateboarding was this reinterpretation of the places that you already are anyway.

Paddy: Hmm. Explain that?

Selema: You, you are walking on the sidewalk, you're using the stairs, right? You're using that handrail or sitting on that le that bench or ledge, and now you get to use it as a place to perform and create and see what else is possible.

And you don't need anything else other than this piece of wood, trucks and four wheels with some grip tape underneath you, you know, your friend's driveway. Happens to have the perfect bank to it, that is nice and deep and steep, that you can turn into a launch ramp

Or even make it simulate a wave.

That's what I loved about skateboarding and anyone could do it. If you [00:19:00] went to visit your friend's inland and they had a, a ramp in the backyard, suddenly y'all were the best homies. Like, do you have this? Like we would, Hey, do you know that guy that we met at such and such?

He's got a ramp in his backyard of his house

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: You've got these new inland homies that speak the same language as you. Right? What kind, what music are you guys listening to? What, what, what? What's that? That's playing as we're skating. Oh, no way. Cool. All right. Let, I'm gonna go to the store and buy that tape or buy that seat. You know what I mean? Like you only get that from skateboarding

Paddy: Really like , what these physical pursuits are, or an entry point into friendship, culture, community, , the arts. Like you become friends, they're introducing you to new food, they're introducing you to, new music, in these different physical pursuits, what about those communities? Do you get, are they overlapping? Are they one big, [00:20:00] giant community? Do they fill the same bucket just from different spigots,

Selema: no skateboarding. Is culture. It is interconnection with every type of person that you can imagine from dirt to emo, to to hip hop, everybody is, is hanging and sharing their cultural perspective and cultural experience within skateboarding. the manner in which skateboarding has influenced and continues to influence pop culture and fashion and street wear.

Paddy: No

Selema: Very much unique, , to, to skateboarding. Surfing is where you go.

I ironically, your goal is to sit in Nirvana, right in, in, in surfing. 'cause you wanna catch the best wave it's a very short experience and your ability to do it. It very much has to do with what nature is choosing to give you in very small increments and moments. Like, oh my God, the tide, the [00:21:00] wind direction, swell, abandon everything for two hours.

You, you're gonna have an opportunity also, everyone else is going to be chasing limited resources, right? The amount of waves, et cetera. And in turn, fighting for the, the chance to experience the thing that made me Yawp. and So it's an interesting dance where you deal with, with selfishness and people's egos, the weather and the waves letting you down.

But then you just, you, you get this moment, you get that wave and you pull into this barrel and time stops and you suddenly have like, are time traveling through your previous lived experience is all sorts of shit happens and you come outta that barrel and you're like, ah, I love this so much.

And it's taken me to South Africa and Fiji and I, I got, I got to surf in the Black Sea in, in, in Russia, in Sochi when I was there for the Olympics in 2014.

Like it's given me friends and in turn, a connection to culture internationally, and I think the mountains [00:22:00] snowboarding is just like, fuck, man. Like, I, I didn't get to riding powder until about 10 years into snowboarding. I was a, a, a big bear rat, and I loved it. I, I loved going to the park and chucking carcass, you know.

Paddy: Yeah. Oh yeah.

Selema: And like snowboarding is rad. Like that, that, that one up of, of playing, , in the park with your friends. Like you played in the park with your friends on the monkey bars is what, you know, park riding is like, oh, you could do that.

Watch. Hey, watch this. I discovered powder and in turn the backcountry. I think it's the dance of like gravity pulling you down a mountain and you having to navigate and interpret, what's going on underneath you according to gravity you go up to the top of a mountain and you go, all right, gravity, [00:23:00] let's party.

Paddy: dance. Yeah.

Selema: Let's dance. Right? And, um, you, it is up to you how much gravity you would like to harness,

Paddy: No doubt there. Yeah.

Selema: And what you would like to do with, either your two or your four edges. Right. To make the experience more thrilling. It's awesome you are in charge of, of, of what all that is. The backcountry changed everything for me. Once I went on, on a, on my, my first cat trip and like really discovered like riding powder.

Paddy: It's the greatest.

Selema: And you're just like, wait, there's surfing here. This whole time.

Oh, okay. this might be the most spiritual dance of all of it. And being able to like, talk about yawping,

Paddy: Mm. Mm-hmm.

Selema: getting down, uh, the, the bottom of, uh, you know, of a steep pitch powder run [00:24:00] where you didn't see that little cliff band, but you had no choice but to hit it, and you suddenly found yourself in this flow state and you, you chucked yourself over this thing that you would not have done if you wouldn't have been in that mode.

And then you get to the bottom after making a few turns and you just, ah, you can't stop screaming and your friends are all screaming and you're like, did we just do that? Yes. Okay, well, let's skin back up or get on a sled, back up or jump in anything that we can to

Paddy: Let's go do it again. Yes.

Selema: and, and do it again. And I think it's, being able to be in, in that energy and also like the raw, quiet powder of the mountains it really feels like a spiritual plugin sometimes.

For me, it's just that much like I said before about like just sitting in the water in between secs, there is something about just standing at the top of a mountain or at the [00:25:00] bottom or after you've just Tommy hawked yourself and sitting in that raw silence

is so powerful because I think it's, sometimes it's, for me it's like, it's the silence of the mountains that makes me feel, how powerful and how humbling it is.

PAUSE PAUSE

You're here dancing in this, in all of its majesty.

But when it's, exactly, you are a visitor and don't get it twisted.

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

Paddy: With all of the sports that you do, with all of the pursuits that you do outside, do they teach you different lessons or is there all kind of like one, , funnel into one lesson?

Selema: Skateboarding has taught me that life is not easy. And that you have to be willing to fall down, hard to get to anything. Great.

Surfing has taught me that you have to put yourself in the most uncomfortable position possible in [00:26:00] order to yield the greatest outcome. If you want to get barreled, like if you want to really get like a, a tube ride,

you have to paddle for and take off on the wave in the exact place where it is trying to end your existence. You cannot go down the shoulder, paddle for the wave, stand there and be like, oh, I don't know why I didn't got, I didn't get barreled

Paddy: Yeah. Yeah, yeah,

Selema: because you were over here, not over here where the shit is happening.

Snowboarding has taught me, in order to have a healthy relationship with the mountains, you gotta have a, a humility. Because it is so, so unpredictable, you can make all the right choices, and then, like, bad shit can still happen snowboarding to me, like requires heightened awareness. And I think that all of those things together are really good applications for life, and I think, [00:27:00] they, they all require community too. if you wanna do them well, you need to assemble, , good humans around you so that you can really enjoy it.

Selema: Like, they're great by themselves, but they're so much better, so much better with

Paddy: So much better.

Selema: so much better with friends, and so much better with people who have dedicated their lives to doing the thing

like the sages, the people who have really said, like, I, I will swear off and don't need, , the most because I get the most here.

I love being around those people.

MUSIC IN THE CLEAR FOR A BEAT

PADDY VO:

Coming up after the break, Selema recounts the conversation with his father that directed the course of his life and career toward the center of our culture.

MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL

Paddy: From the outside looking in on your, [00:28:00] professional life and your personal life in these pursuits, you're in the gooey center of these things, and you've said that when you were 22, you had purposely avoided going to college to spend all your time devoted to surfing and snowboarding, and that's when your dad kind of called you out, right?

He asked you, , what you were doing. He said, what's up with your life? You can't just be one of those guys. Those guys aren't cool. If you're gonna do this, find a way to get close to it. I have a couple questions about this.

Selema: Yeah.

Paddy: What did he mean by that? How impactful was that to your life, and then what happened next?

Selema: Again, outstanding research PaddyO

Paddy: I am a curious human and you, sir, have a remarkable catalog of curiosities to dig into

Selema: I think I, I believe that curiosity will save us, so I, so I really [00:29:00] appreciate it. My dad was confused by me. He, he wanted his son to be a musician.

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: It's like, I don't know what your dad did, but I'm sure there was a part of him was just rolling the dice, being like, come on Paddy.

Paddy: I think mostly he just wanted me to grow a mustache and watch the bears and say the F word and, and smile

Selema: there you go.

Paddy: So, so I do that?

Selema: and, and brat out with him

Paddy: Yeah, totally. Hey, did you see a game? I can't believe this. Where'd you park?

PAUSE PAUSE

Selema: I think my dad saw a young man who was excited but didn't know where he was going. And that's, that worried him that I was a, a bit aimless and that my identity was gonna suffer. He just wanted me to pick a direction and not just float. So when he said to me like, those guys aren't cool.

Ooh. He meant like the people who just like recreate at a thing and sort of have a life that [00:30:00] looks, cool but are broke

Paddy: yeah, yeah,

Selema: are not that cool

Paddy: yeah,

Selema: Like, you know. And so he was like, if you wanna do this surfing thing, that is completely foreign to me. And if it's what you say it is, prove it. If this surfing and snowboarding thing and this world is what you say it is, prove it. Go find a way to be in it. And I was scared ' cause I was bummed that I couldn't be pro or get sponsored.

And so I didn't know what that meant. And he was like. Uh, you better, you better fucking figure out a way to get up in it. And that was the best advice because my dad thinking that I wasn't cool, that was heartbreaking.

Paddy: God. I bet.

Selema: 'cause my dad was

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: cool

Paddy: He's hanging out with Paul Simon. It's like, man, come on.

Selema: there would be no Paul Simon Graceland album without my

father, like the thing wouldn't have happened.

Paddy: Yeah,

Selema: And my dad had had a very [00:31:00] storied career, there was no silver in his spoon. My dad fled South Africa in the midst of apartheid. Like if he stayed, he was going to jail, or dying. And so he had to flee his country because he had the audacity to wanna make music with Mike White musicians and challenge this idea.

Of a systemic racism that was supposed to work for everyone. He was like, nah, this is bullshit. And so he made his way to America and, worked his ass off and got sponsored into the Manhattan School of Music and then moved to Los Angeles and then started making like African driven pop music that no one had ever heard before and then had a big hit, and then his whole life changed.

But he wasn't, he didn't think that was gonna happen. He was just pursuing this thing that he loved with everything he had. So he was like, look, we don't do shit just for fun.

So if this is what you're doing, make it your music.

Paddy: What your dad is [00:32:00] saying is like, this can't be like an individual pursuit. Make it your thing, but find a a way to, to make art for the community. Be community minded. Get your head out of yourself and into otherness.

Selema: That's exactly what he was saying. That's, that's exactly what he was saying.

Paddy: Thanks dad.

Selema: And yeah. You know, I would say maybe 12 years later when I got to have him in the Staples Center at X Games as a, 20,000 people Vert Vert contest, you know, like I got him there, like on the side of the ramp.

And I'm the one who's doing the broadcast to the world, like I'm on a, B, C. And he, after the event, he comes, you know, they brought him to my booth where I was, and he sat, like, they put him front row right there at the vert ramp. He was so mind blown.

Paddy: Oh, I

Selema: And he said to me, he goes, man, why didn't you tell me that skateboarding was jazz?

[00:33:00] Man?

Paddy: God, that's so cool. What a cool question.

Selema: Why didn't you tell me, man, it's music, man. I'm watching these guys on the vert ramp, man. And then like, you know, the one guy is dropping in and he's doing his maneuvers and all the other guys are watching him. This was during practice. And then the next guy, like, he drops in right after him. And you know, they're playing solos, man.

They're watching each other. They're in the groove. There's a rhythm, there's a respect. They're making music together. He said, this is the most beautiful thing ever, man. Why didn't you tell me I would've come a long time ago? And, and then the last thing he said was, and you are the one who's explaining this to the entire world, man.

Paddy: Oh my God. Did that feel so amazing?

Selema: whew. He said, he said, I'm so proud of

Paddy: Oh, dude, you're gonna

Selema: You are, you are the, you are, you are the voice of this thing, man, to the whole world. It's so beautiful. I'm so proud of you. I'm so happy.

Paddy: Oh God. [00:34:00] Dude,

Selema: It broke me, bro. Like, I, I, even now, as I sit here and I tell you that story, like tears are in my eyes because, you know, as a son, , all you could ever hope for is for you to get unsolicited. Acknowledgement of your thing and the choices that you've made from your parents.

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: so when they, when you're not begging them for it, and then they just, give you the, Hey, I see you.

Paddy: Mm.

Selema: I see you, and I am proud.

Paddy: The proud part

Selema: Um, I, I didn't know it, I didn't know it was a thing that I even

Paddy: Mm.

Selema: but when I tell you that shit hit me in my chest and ripped me open, it was like, oh gosh.

And like, you know, I, I trace it all back to that day in New York, sitting in his house where he just was like, the fuck is going on with you,

Paddy: Just as that first day surfing in Carlsbad is this explosion of your barbaric yawp, your [00:35:00] introduction into all of these, pursuits and passions that become the center of your heart, your dad calling you out. Is that , , the doorway into working for Trans World, working for ESPN, working for X Games? You're bringing all of this passion and then you blow through this door Now you're that guy. Explaining it, conducting it, speaking it to the world. Thank God you didn't go pro in any of these sports, man,

Selema: ab, absolutely. Well, thankfully I was not good enough to even entertain. There was a moment there where I thought that I. Maybe could have had a, a, a surfing career if I moved to Hawaii and just threw myself into it. But

Paddy: But nobody's got like the, the cutback or the kick flip of chitchatting like you do, bro. You know, you got, you got,

Selema: that's really,

Paddy: I call it mouth athleticism and you got some mouth athleticism, brother.

Selema: that that is, that is, that is very [00:36:00] humbling. I, I think the thing that that has set me apart as a broadcaster, a commentator,

my gifts come from. I think being able to contextualize what I'm seeing in a way that people who do it all the time and have never done it before can digest and feel. That's my goal.

Paddy: And that is a such a difficult thing to appeal to the core, while also inviting in the general viewer. That's not easy.

Selema: I think it's because I was late to the party.

I didn't grow up generationally, core'd out. And to feel like this was just our thing. I Got to all this shit late. Right? And so the amount of discovery of what it meant to me and like how it altered my life, it wasn't an option. It was just like, well shit, this is, I'm here.

This is what ha is happening and we're going.

Paddy: you guys know about this? Everybody come quick. Do you guys know about this? It's so great. Yeah. Everybody,

Selema: [00:37:00] yeah, everyone, they're like, shut up, bro. Like we already know. Like, no, you don't know. And everyone else

Paddy: Yeah. Totally. Totally.

Selema: And that's kind of was I think my thing. I also learned that from, from watching my father in between songs on stage.

His superpower was like contextualizing why you needed to hear this song. And even though he was , singing the song in Tu or Zulu or, , he gave you enough context about South Africa and where he grew up and what the cultural aspects of the song were. That when he started playing the song and singing the song, you were there walking through the village, you felt a desire to know more about that place that he's singing about from thousands of miles away. as much As I, I love my dad's playing and his singing, it was that shit he did in between that was just mind blowing. 'cause I would watch him steal people's souls that way and [00:38:00] that informed. How I talked about the thing

Paddy: yeah.

Selema: even when I was on the phone as a receptionist at transworld talking to shops, you know, across the country, I would have these conversations that were way longer than they were supposed to be because I was curious about where they were from and what was going on in their scene.

And then I would like story tell them what was going on in our scene. Like again, You got to sit in exchange and story tell with folks. And that was my favorite part about getting in.

And then also just getting in and, and finding these people who were writers and photographers and brand builders and marketers and creators and, these brilliant minds who were also just as geeked to like stay close to the thing. I was so blown by who they were and then the collective creativity that was taking place in these spaces that I was like, ah, yeah, I gotta figure out what my place is. And then eventually realized that it was my voice.

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

Paddy: [00:39:00] You built your career on your skills as a talker, as a people person, as a storyteller. So how has your ability to strike up a conversation with anyone and befriend anyone helped your mission to do that?

To build bridges, to increase diversity, to increase community, to get out of your own personal pursuit of this thing and invite more people in?

Selema: You asked me at the very beginning, you know, what about all these things? Skating, surfing, snowboarding, and I think the key word was community.

You do this thing as an individual but it takes place in collective, that was very powerful to be able to get like this, have instant community anywhere I went in the world, I show up at a mountain, I'm holding a snowboard. Someone else has got a snowboard. Hey, where are you from? Where you from? Wanna ride the chair lift with me? Cool. Hey, we're going to this place afterwards.

Alright, you wanna come out dinner? Boom. Hey, we're going to this place. Boom. Next thing you know, are we friends? I think we're

Paddy: International language of Stoke.

Selema: international [00:40:00] language of, so, hey, follow me through these trees. I'm gonna show you something. That's what

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: it was right here the whole time I've

Paddy: no idea.

Selema: awesome.

Hey man, can I buy you a beer? Where are you from? Where are you from? No way. Okay, boom. Right? We're bonded. And I want that for everybody

PAUSE PAUSE

in a world that is constantly telling you all the reasons why you need to keep to your own

and not engage with other, or that this space here is for you, but not that space over there because you don't have what they have. So just be content and stay over here, know your place.

The outdoors are the great equalizer and the great reveal that that's all bullshit, that none of it is true because I can take anyone from anywhere, put them on top of a mountain or in the [00:41:00] ocean. Or on the side of a bowl. Teach them to access the thing. And once they access the feeling, it's a wrap.

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: They're in and they're connected. And they are now of the entirety of this thing.

The outdoors are an oasis. They are an oxygen mask.

And I want that for everybody.

PAUSE PAUSE

MUSIC FADES UP

Paddy: When it's all said and done, what do you want your legacy to be? What do you want your mark on our world to be?

Selema: I would like to be remembered for how I made people feel.

I feel bad for wealthy people whose identity is wrapped up in their possessions. Because rarely do people like, oh my God, remember that? Oh, he had so much money

Paddy: That's what people say at at, yeah. At funerals. That's what people say.

Selema: yeah. And he had the [00:42:00] so many cars

Paddy: Bob died with so much in his bank account. Please join us afterwards for finger sandwiches.

Selema: yes. And the thread count of his beds and his suits. Oh, we'll miss, we'll miss the way he displayed. Not that there's anything at a base level wrong with the having of things. I like, I love nice things. I like to dress all those, but no one's gonna talk about that shit

Paddy: No. No.

Selema: Like maybe they'd say like occasionally he had good style occasionally,

Paddy: yeah.

Selema: I hope that the things that I do and the way that I do them, or the feeling that I give to my friends and my family, I want them to talk about that after I'm gone. That's why I effort on a daily basis to try to be less shitty at the things I'm shitty at and continue to get better, , at the things, , that I'm [00:43:00] good at in that, in how I make people feel.

MUSIC IN THE CLEAR FOR A BEAT

Paddy: It is time for the final ramble.

One piece of gear you cannot live without.

Selema: My Burton Alakazam signature Model one 60. Did I mention it was signature model?

Paddy: Like whatever, man. You're not pro, but you're pro.

Best outdoor snack.

Selema: Jerky

Paddy: Love it. pocket warmed.

Selema: Pocket, warm jerky, and also pocket bacon

Paddy: You're not the only person to say that, and I appreciate how that is some connective tissue

Selema: pocket bacon mmmmmmM!.

Paddy: What is your hottest outdoor hot take?

Selema: The ski industry, , is disinterested in the growing of these sports, , and at some point as they continue to rak in all this money and raising prices every year and laughing and high fiving each other at some point.

Shit is gonna blow up and when it does, I'm gonna to be like sitting back [00:44:00] with a hot cup of cocoa watching the fireworks.

Paddy: And thank God the industry doesn't set the culture.

Selema: Exactly. The

Paddy: That is us.

Selema: what you said right there, I, I said this to the someone the other day we were talking about, they're like, you know, why, why is the surf industry over? The greatest lie the surf industry ever told was that it was the definition of the culture.

Paddy: no way. No, no. Industry is the definition of the culture. the industry is only able to exist and is held up by the culture. And the culture is the people doing the thing and passing the thing on. So the industry needs to turn around and say, thank you people.

Thank you, community. Here is how I'm going to help you. Look at us. We're getting super hot. Hot takes.

Selema: Boom. Our passes are are not going to work

Paddy: Yeah, dude, we are, we are.

Ah,

Selema: gonna be, I gonna be sliding, sliding you into the gate. Like aaaahhhh,

Paddy: Yeah.

Selema: Um, I can't, the thing's not opening for me to get on the, the up thing

Paddy: Well, that's because you pissed off Big [00:45:00] Snow later. Oh no. Yeah. Take your pocket bacon and beat it. Dweeb. Ugh.

Selema: Yeah. Take your B bacon and get to skinning

Paddy: Yeah, yeah, totally.

OUTRO

Selema Masekela is a television host, sports commentator, actor, and musician. He's also the Chief of Sports Culture for XGames and hosts the podcast, What Shapes Us, which you can listen to wherever you get your podcasts or you can watch it on �����ԹϺ���TV. Keep up with his adventures, and all of his many jobs, on Instagram AT Selema.

The �����ԹϺ��� Podcast is hosted and produced by me, Paddy O'Connell. But you can call me PaddyO. Storytelling support provided by Micah "the emotional baby bird" Abrams. Music and Sound Design by Robbie Carver. And booking and research by Maren Larsen.

The �����ԹϺ��� Podcast is made possible by our �����ԹϺ��� Plus members. [00:46:00] Learn about all the extra rad benefits and become a member yourself at �����ԹϺ���Online dot com slash pod plus.

Music in the Clear for a beat

podcaster to a podcaster if you have a, spot to fill.

Selema: Oh, we're, we're gonna flip

Paddy: Yeah. You Have very much scratched my back, sir. .

Selema: Trust me, I'm hitting you up for the reverse. It's gonna be fun. That sounded very sexual. Please tell your wife that I, that's not,

Paddy: No, that's how we're gonna

Selema: not what I was inferring

Paddy: we're gonna, that is how we're starting this interview. That is gonna be the cold open, no context. That sounded very sexual. Hi everybody, and welcome to the show.